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The Official Effort To Ban That Fucker BigSugar Forth-Fucking-With!! The offending comment;
Anybody else here have the desire to cum all over Pink's face? No, The response;
There is a time and place for profanity. But asking if I want to Please find some manners, dude.
First off, if anybody finds some manners lying around, apparently I need to know where they are and come and rescue them from....I don't know. Whatever happens when manners are disused. Now, this little exchange is what I feel is at the heart of a lot of problems with the internet. One guy makes a joke that another guy doesn't like. The Joker is a douche and the Offended Party get to do what human beings seem to love doing more than anything else. They get to be righteously indignant. They get to feel the soft, warm glow of morality as they sit in judgement of something another person did that we can all agree is "just plain wrong!" You might wanna take this moment to read the offending coment once more. Yeah. I know what I've written since I've been here and I can assure you that that bit is among the least offensive things I've written (or said on the radio show, come to that). But everybody's got a threshold. And the Offended Party was not only nauseated, but thoroughly discouraged by one comment. To the Offended Party, I want to say this; I, BigSugar, in no way represent the whole of karmacritic.com. I am a member in good standing, nothing more. An ordinary citizen. So please do not judge the entirety of this site based only on my "contributions" (if I may be so bold). I'm sorry that you were offended by what I wrote. I'm sorry you feel like it was an attack on someone whom you admire and have a great deal of compassion for. It wasn't my intention to upset you, anger you, nauseate or frustrate you. By way of explanation only, I intended the comment in question to be a humorous jab at pop culture as well as myself. I'm sorry that you didn't understand this intention. I sincerely hope that you can find your way to, at the very least, continuing to support this site and the members who have in no way irritated you. You have a strong, unique voice, and your participation could very well mean the difference to someone who is in need of a fine example or encouragement. Please do not abandon those for whom you could make a difference.
So, here's what I'm going to do. This post allows replies, as do they all, so if you want to get me the fuck out of the door, here's your chance. A post with "Aye" in the title is a vote for me to pack it in. "Nay" keeps the 'Sugar in yo coffee. If you've got something to say, by all means, exercise your right to do so. But at the end of the week, the "Ayes" and "Nays" get tallied and if the people want my ass out the door, you have my word that I will take down every blog post, every review, every film and I will resign my post on the radio show. You have my word. In case you're wondering, I didn't post this as a poll so you'll have to put your name beside your vote. You should have to. You have a problem with what I say, or the way I say it, I think I should have the right to meet my accusers in open court. You want me gone? Now's your chance. You have one week. And if you don't give a fuck, just sit there and have another drink.
Submitted by BigSugar on September 29, 2008 - 3:31am. |
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Nay
good clip
it cheers me up a little..... good stuff, glad I watched it :)
what the fuck is this
Look Sugar, you are part of KarmaCritic and part of us as much as our fucking logo. If all it takes is votes to get you to abandon us, then fuck, I'm dissapointed in -you- man. WHO GIVES A FUCK what people think?? Please, stay with us, and ignore anyone who thinks that them leaving KC and MAKING YOU LEAVE KC are somehow morally equivalent options. They're not. One is free will, the other is the exact opposite.
Anyone is free to come or go, and if anything in KC makes anyone leave, by all means leave, but dont ask us to change. We're "as is". We're "take it or leave it". Sugar, please, restore my faith by telling me it takes more than this to make you abandon us. It HAS to take more man, after all we've been through.
As for Pink:
When Pink was in highschool, a gay friend of hers said he had never
seen female anatomy, so, she showed him and he proclaimed, "its pink!"
Pink said this herself in an interview on THS, and so she was nicknamed
Pink.
So, no, I don't think Pink herself would even take offense to what you said.
Enough said.
P.S. Lets chat about project Skavenger, call me up,
P.S.2. I voted one fucking star on this post. what is this shit. Ack, I need some sleep. not a good way to start monday
So what you're saying is
Pink would only let him cum on her face if he was gay?
AYE
I am repulsed. I even feel violated myself. This is disgusting. How could anyone say anything so insensative? That's not Christian and these type of comments shows that there are no values in ones life except for being perverse in the most profane manner one can express themselves in.
Big Sugar.
This person had no right to speak to you this way!
I say AYE to to BigSugar keepin' true to himself and how he chooses to write/talk/masturbate to pictures of Pink's pink.
___________________________________
DONNA MAY
If you read the above---I did not know it was you that wrote what you wrote. I just found out--and I don't want to delete cause I meant it--but not against you. Just in general, here is what I want to say and to make a reminder to all members of karmacritic.
This site has a wild bunch. For example, there are the Pirates of Karma--and then there are the karmaCritters. And then there is BigSugar. whew
But in all whatever cases, all of these members are very supportive people. BigSugar isn't the only one with a mouth someone might find foul or offensive. But it's just the nature of some of us here.
Donna, you've been a strong supporter of this website. Why would you leave? So what, someone said something you didn't like. You know how many people have said personal things about me? About me. ME. Not Pink or whomever. ME. I'm still here. Why would I leave? I get wild and start battles, but I don't leave.
Some people express themselves differently. Just cause you don't, doesn't mean that person did anything wrong. What if I worked in Porn, and posted blogs about how this dildo got slammed up this big tittie chicks ass, and it took me three takes before I got the shot, her ass bled and we had to call a butt surgeon blah blah blah. Doesn't that make me unethical? I'm speaking freely about what I was working on.
BigSugar does his weekly movie review. And that's the way his reviews go. And that's not only his voice, but his sort of "hook" or "gimmick". To review movies the way people really talk about movies. Our review section, including our radio show was NEVER meant to be proper in any way or like Siskel and Roeper. And to some, yes, they might find it offensive or out of hand--or you can look at it from the perspective of being entertaining instead of reading the same kind of normal boring movie review you would get from other movie websites.
And if it bothers you, just like anything else, you just simply don't read it. Listen to it. Or watch it.
I know BigSugar did not mean to offend you or anyone else.
You and I have been good internet friends. Even have spoken on the phone. Don't leave. All of KC has been proud to have you as a member here. It would be a shame to lose you or anyone else simply because of blah.
DRINK UP ME'HEARTIES YO HO!
Just to clarify
I though Nay was "don't leave."
DON'T LEAVE SUGAR. PLEASE DON'T. WE LOVE YOU. MUCHO LUV U.
haha
If you leave BigSugar. Then I'm leaving. I'm leaving....and I'm never coming back! ever 4 ever!
boo hoo
BOO HOO
In fact. I'm logging out right now for a few hours. And I won't be logging back in until those few hours have passed!
Wait... I can't......I can't.
WAIT! But I must....I must....
There is no more EZ on KC......
haha
DRINK UP ME'HEARTIES YO HO!
Sugar don't act like a
Sugar don't act like a BITCH! You a FUCKING man! and a big fucker too! You leave and I will hunt you down and cut you off at the knees. You would still be taller then EZ. lol
please don't go.
BTW, what do you think about that email I sent you? (KC email)
0
The Little Things Give You Away
Look, this isn't a fight, this isn't a flame war and this isn't me whining. This is an opportunity for the community as a whole to speak up and let everyone know where we stand. Thing is, if you actually espouse free speech as a value, then you have to be willing to pay the price for it. Someone will say something that offends you. You will be offended or grossed out or enraged. I think there are some people (I'm thinking Shamalamadingdong here) for whom that's simply too high a cost. And you know what, I'm not certain he doesn't have a point. If we have a community here, shouldn't we have community standards? Shouldn't those community standards be enforced? So, what does karmacritic.com, the people, the community, what do we really value more: Insularity or freedom?
Frankly, I don't think anyone really gives a fuck either way. I'm a fucking rodeo clown, nothing more. And an inability to recognize that is probably worse than being offended by me.
If it's just ridiculous, it's bad.
IF IT IS RRIIIDDDIICCUUULLOOUUSS, then it's okay.
nice
nice
Community Standards
The community standards are: I choose who to let in based on the single criteria of whether I think they're filmmakers or not. Once they're in, they're free to say whatever they want as long as they don't disprove the criteria upon which they were let in. That's it. Let me repeat this: in KarmaCritic all members can say ANYTHING within federal law. Anything the First Amendment lets you say, you can say. That's the standard. I've only made exceptions for actual non-hypothetical lawsuit issues, which I hope no one will hold against me. Other than that, again, our community standard is freedom of speech. Heck, the name of our server provider is "NearlyFreeSpeech", and I specifically chose it because I knew we would host controversial stuff online (and we pay extra for that, too, NearlyFreeSpeech isn't the cheapest, but they're the most reliable anti-censorship host around). So there. It's all part of the plan. It's not a democracy, it's not even fair. But its very very very free. I wouldn't have it any other way.
Now, as for paying the price.... .. I have. You weren't here then, but I lost half the original founding members because I refused to ban EZ when EZ said things that offended and/or enraged said half of founding members. EZ himself wrote me an email, saying that for the sake of the community, he was okay with getting banned, and that he would find other ways to support KC. Hell no. The price was half the site, and I paid it without fucking blinking. And if the price had been 99% of the site, I would have still paid it. I'm the kind of guy who has no qualms whatsoever about walking away from very profitable deals just because some principle nobody else thought was important (or even noticed) had been compromised. I know it looks dumb when it happens, and it does hurt me in the short term, but its the -only- way I could live with myself in the long term, and I know this.
Also, it's not the first time this comes up. Someone said "Peter Jackson" had been turned off by BigSugar's comments in the radio show the week before and was "getting cold feet" about his interview, remember? Sugar, you an I talked about this on the phone, remember when I said that if I have to choose between Peter Jackson and you, I would choose you? I dont fucking bluff. That was before I knew the whole Peter Jackson thing was a fairy tale.
Before that, BlogTalkRadio had stopped featuring us. Our audience was cut in half because of this. And once again I said that if I have to choose between censoring people and losing the show, I'd rather lose the show. It still stands. Nobody pays me to do what I do, so the only real incentive is freedom. And let me add: MORE than one person have told me the show would be boring without you, and I believe that, absolutely.
I don't remember the exact scenario but I know I've said this to you before Matt. And the other thing I said to you one time: please don't talk bad about yourself. You're not a rodeo clown, because I'd be embarrassed to have given the top prize of SUBLIM to a rodeo clown, EZ would have not risked his rep with Jon Brown for RED or with Tova for an internship with a rodeo clown, and I certainly would not be waiting for your phone call to start a serious screenplay writing partnership with a rodeo clown. I have never offered a screenplay writing partnership to anyone else, ever. I know you're half joking and everything, and it sounds cute or whatever, but don't do it man. It doesn't endear you amongst friends cuz we friends are already endeared to you the max. We cap out, and just get puzzled. And it doesn't endear you amongst strangers either, specially not in hollywood where people are used to hear the opposite kind of talk. When you say you don't think anyone gives a fuck, you think you're only putting yourself down, and therefore that's okay. Double wrong. One, it's not okay (its just not), and Two, you're putting down everybody who does give a fuck, which happens to include me. Don't do it man, c'mon.
Lets put the drama into Skavenger instead, call me up :)
One Love/People Get Ready
Well, thank you sir, but what I'm looking for here is the opposition argument. For those who do feel like I'm over the line, why? And really, what would you do about it? What would the consequenses be? What's that line about the Nazis? "They came for the Jews and I didn't protest because I wasn't Jewish....." finally they come for him and there's no one left to protest, that kind of thing. If the Offended Party feels that they have been wronged, I love that they have the right to stand up and be heard. So, the point of this whole execise is to demonstrate that morals and values are easy when there's nothing at stake. If there is no cost, all manner of plattitudes come spilling out. But when there's a consequence, good or ill, no matter how small, that changes the complexion of the argument. And let's remember, this started from one sentence at the top of a review that has nothing to do with said post. On the face of it, it's rather silly, but when you put a consequence to it, now you have drama.
I'll say it again, this isn't me pouting or stomping off with my little red wagon. I want the argument. I want the dissent. Is the safe path actually as safe as you think, or is it even more dangerous than you can imagine? Is being polite, inoffensive, milquetoast even, more destuctive than a raving lunatic? I know how I feel and I know how you feel Marco, but what about those people like the Offended Party? How do they feel and why do they think that way? Is it possible to change their minds?
This isn't about me, man. It's about us, all of us. The offended party was also a rather prominent player in the Sublim contest as well. So it seems we have an opportunity for a real discussion here. Let's see what happens.
If it's just ridiculous, it's bad.
IF IT IS RRIIIDDDIICCUUULLOOUUSS, then it's okay.
Stick Around
And for the record, I want to cum on Pink's face.
"Baffling the critics since 1971."
DAMN IT !
First the economy. Now KarmaCritic. What is the world cumming to?
DRINK UP ME'HEARTIES YO HO!
Big Sugar...NAY NAY NAY NAY NAY NAY NAY!
Is that clear enough?? ;)
Look, I may not always like what you say, but I'll defend you're right to say it. Oh wait, I guess that's not completely my quote, but it still applies. And, this is coming from probably the least liberal member on this site!!!
You can't have KarmaCoffee without BigSugar, nor can you have KarmaCritic. Listen to Marco and EZ -- they won't lead you wrong when it comes to friendship, loyalty and business.
I mean it. You may be colorful, but it's black, white and gray that make the world drab. You provide a kelidoskope of things to get conversations moving. And, KarmaCritic is a very different community than others.
And besides, you are a darn good writer (which reminds me -- I still need to read Cuties!!!). My only excuse for not having done so yet is how much time I spend at work writing, and how much time I spend at home reading in preparation for guest interviews with authors for our 'radio' show.
In fact, here's something that might pique curiosity. Right now, I'm reading a book that has a lesbian vampire in it. (How's that for remeniscense, Big Sugar? haha) In fact, this community would probably love the book, "Fangland" by John Marks. Est Fantastique.
Anyway, don't you dare leave, Matt!!! I've stuck around, and maybe I'm not around as much due to how busy life is at the moment, but you can't leave! I needz me sugar, arghhhh! lol
Sorry...this is all
The good thing is there is...
... a band called Ac/Dc.
The band is not a movie or make believe.
They will be in California in the next couple months.
Oakland.
Let me know.
Nay!!!
Can I get some cream with that?
HOLY DAMN!
Cream it!
DRINK UP ME'HEARTIES YO HO!
Wow, what a ruckus!
So I guess I'm the Offended Party that caused this ruckus. Little ole me, Donna May. I did state my opinion in a way that was direct. Perhaps what I should have said was this:
Big Sugar, I really like your writing. You've got great style and your script Red kicks ass. I can't wait to see it on the screen. When you talk about sucking this and putting this or that wherever, in my opinion, is like pollution. It gets in the way of the good stuff. I can't see the beauty for the trash.
And it's rude to the person you're talking about. Even if you'll never meet them. (You're in LA now, you might meet them!)
Even though I think you are a good writer, I have avoided your postings for this reason only. Viewing the remarks about Pink were unavoidable because they were on the home page.
Marco, I said nothing about censorship. It's wonderful to let folks speak their mind. It lets them tell you who they are.
Big Sugar, I never suggested you be banned.
Hope this clears the air.
Donna May (aka Bikini Vampire #1)
Thank you Donna!
Donna, looking back I think some of my replies were a bit more forceful than they should have, it was a bad monday and I didn't take it well when I read BigSugar had gotten this idea about banning himself.. I was reacting emotionally as I usually do in the mornings when my brain hasn't fully kicked in.
I'm really glad you've cleared the air, and I think the way things are it all works: BigSugar continues to use profanity, and you continue avoiding his posts for that reason, its a perfect balance of freedom of speech and free will. I think it works out really well.
Thanks again for clearing the air, I really appreciate it, and I'm glad to have you with us! :)
CLEAR AIR AFTER THE FART
It's always warm and fuzzy afterward. Why is that?
haha
DRINK UP ME'HEARTIES YO HO!
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